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 Post subject: X300 keyboard
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:38 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 8:37 am
Posts: 22
Location: Nottingham Nottinghamshire, UK
I was looking at some of the X300 clips on youtube and I noticed that the Japanese clip (Julie Andrews et al) has an inverted 'L' blue enter key. The other clips show the 'normal' horizontal blue enter key. I'm writing this on my UltraNav Travel USB board which has the inverted key shape.

Why would there be two board versions of this new X300 machine?

Of course I may be 'seeing things'. I prefer the inverted shape.


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 Post subject: Re: X300 keyboard
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:50 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2005 7:51 am
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Location: UK
Haven't there always been at least 2 options? the inverted 'L' is the certainly standard in the UK, and horizontal is standard in the US?

My X300, T60p and T42p all have the inverted 'L'

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:16 am 
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well other keyboards aren't in QWERTY format and they also need less keys (less symbols) so they have more space for some bigger keys.

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 Post subject: Re: X300 keyboard
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:34 am 
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Location: Nottingham Nottinghamshire, UK
ddignam wrote:
Haven't there always been at least 2 options? the inverted 'L' is the certainly standard in the UK, and horizontal is standard in the US?

My X300, T60p and T42p all have the inverted 'L'


If there are two options then that is good news because I prefer the inverted 'L' - easier to strike it with my little pinkie. I don't know if either is standard in the UK though.


Last edited by argonaut on Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:41 am 
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Location: Nottingham Nottinghamshire, UK
SHoTTa35 wrote:
well other keyboards aren't in QWERTY format and they also need less keys (less symbols) so they have more space for some bigger keys.


Well, my UltraNav is English qwerty and has the inverted 'L'. I don't really know too much about board standards in other countries. I did see Tom Hanks on a UK chat show recently. Apparently he is a typewriter buff and has lots of them. He was rambling on about qwerty boards and qwertz boards and all the other 'interesting' historical differences - the host commited seppuku live on screen in reaction, which would have been a relief because his BBC contract is for an obscene amount of money. :-)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:35 pm 
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According to Wikipedia, only US/Dutch keyboard has the horizontal enter key.

The inverted "L" enter key seems bigger and easier to hit on an X series ThinkPad.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:42 pm 
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Location: Nottingham Nottinghamshire, UK
ulrich.von.lich wrote:
According to Wikipedia, only US/Dutch keyboard has the horizontal enter key.

The inverted "L" enter key seems bigger and easier to hit on an X series ThinkPad.



Why only Dutch in Euroland? Dams...and small fingers?



I do agree.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:57 pm 
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Location: London
I bought a UK TopSeller X300 which came with UK keyboard...

... but I'm an Aussie and the keyboard Aussies grow up with is a US keyboard.

On the UK keyboard:
* backslash is to the left of the "Z" key and the return key is upside down L

I wonder how long before ebay will have Lenovo X300 spare parts so I can pick myself up a US keyboard?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 3:55 am 
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Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
argonaut wrote:
ulrich.von.lich wrote:
According to Wikipedia, only US/Dutch keyboard has the horizontal enter key.

The inverted "L" enter key seems bigger and easier to hit on an X series ThinkPad.


Why only Dutch in Euroland? Dams...and small fingers?

I do agree.

The Wikipedia article is incorrect. The Dutch layout does have an inverted L, just like all the other European keyboards. (I've seen them on both ThinkPads and classic IBM Model M keyboards). But the article does correctly note that most computers in the Netherlands are equipped with a standard US keyboard (with horizontal Enter of course). It's just something we've become accustomed to.


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 Post subject: Re: X300 keyboard
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 4:29 am 
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argonaut wrote:
snip....Why would there be two board versions of this new X300 machine?.....snip


There has always been two/more versions since early IBM days and most of us on the other side of Atlantic prefer the non "L" inverted version.

FYI:

A basic understanding of keyboards and how they work around the world can help avoid problems in application development.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 1:58 pm 
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Location: Israel
All the Thinkpad and IBM/Lenovo desktop keyboards here in Israel also have the US layout (slim Enter).

Actually I would live happily with an inverted L for Enter, but what I find unacceptable is the shrunk LShift. It would be a Overused word for me to use such a keyboard.

An ideal layout in my opinion is:

* One large Enter where the Enter and Backslash are on the US keyboard
* Shrink RShift a bit and place a small Backslash key to its right.

I prefer this because it would make the Enter much easier to hit (right now I still find myself hitting Backslash instead of it way too often, even after 3 years of experience with this layout), and at the same time, both Shift keys and the Backspace would still be large enough.

A similar layout with the Backslash moved to the top row, to the left of the Backspace would be worse, because it would make the Backspace smaller.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:39 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 6:10 pm
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Location: Silkeborg Denmark
In Denmark, the inverted L enter is standard!

The same in norway i think.. ?

But i dont know why, doesent we have more keys than on the us keyboards? I have never seen Æ Ø and Å on us keyboards :lol:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:57 am 
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Location: Münster, Germany
hi,

here in germany we also use inverted "L".

It´s pretty comfortable.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 12:34 pm 
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Agotthelf wrote:
hi,

here in germany we also use inverted "L".

It´s pretty comfortable.


Same inverted "L" in France. :)

My 701Cs has the horizontal <Enter> key, and it's not as comfortable as the inverted "L".

W.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 1:00 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:34 pm
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Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Czech Republic does also use inverted L enter key, but when buying keyboard (USB, PS/2), you often find the US layout.

Personally, I don't care about the enter key, both are fine with me. What I dislike about the European layouts is the narrow left shift key. Shortcuts such as ctrl+shift+something are a bit tough with that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:46 pm 
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Location: TX, USA
I don't like the addition of a "right mouse click" (or "context menu") key between the right side Alt and Ctrl on my X300. It seems useless, and pushes the right Ctrl key too far away.

I like to Ctrl-click a web page link to open it in a new browser tab. I do this with my right hand, by holding down the right Ctrl key with my pinkie and clicking the TrackPoint left button with my thumb.

The problem is that I now inadvertently hold down this "right mouse click" key with my pinkie instead of the Ctrl key!

I know that Lenovo added this key at the same time as the Windows key on the other side of the Space bar, but I wish they didn't...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 3:09 am 
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Location: Lyon, France
Hello,

When I want to open a new tab, with IE or Firefox, I use the middle mouse button, it's quicker, and you don't need to use a key.

:)

W.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 5:43 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2006 12:45 pm
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Location: Belgium
Belgian (Azerty) keyboard also has the inverted "L". Inverted "L" or not, key count is the same. However, as Zender noted, some keyboards have a narrow left shift key to have an extra key, and so does my keyboard. As it is the "<" (and ">" with shift) key in mine case, it would be hard to program without the key.

@WarMachine: That doesn't work with the middle ultranav button if it's configured standard (scrolling) on windows. It works on linux though, even if configured for scrolling.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 8:45 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 3:01 pm
Posts: 31
Location: Barcelona, Spain
Hello everybody,


I plan to buy an X300 in the USA, it's quite cheaper there than here (Europe): ~2800€ vs ~1800€.

My question is if I will be able to find a replacement keyboard in the future for the X300, and how expensive would it be.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:06 am 
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tirant wrote:
My question is if I will be able to find a replacement keyboard in the future for the X300, and how expensive would it be.

i paid about $120 USD for my japanese layout keyboard through IBM parts here in the US.   other layouts may be more or less expensive depending on where you buy them.


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